it seems like playing style, and tone have just become non existant

i watched some of the copetition entries for some competitions and i noticed a couple things.

1) everyones tone if its a quality entry, is almost the same, same metal tone for everyone, i mean with some variation, but nothing like the "broken up distortion" if you know what i mean

basicly i like to say there are a cople types of distortion

blues distortion, just the tiniest amount

skynyrd distortion, not too much just enough

led zeppelin type,enough distortion to play fast with sustain but not too much i like to call this crunch distortion or broken up distortion, which is the chords are distorted, but lead isnt too distorted, if uve ever gotten a led zeppelin tone youd know what i mean

randy rhoads type, i like to call this rolling distortion, especially his studio albums, i think of it like distortion is a ball rolling down a hill, idk it just sounds like that to me bassicly, its a lot of distortion but still hear the broken up distortion in the chords and lead you hve plenty of sustain. the rolling i think i got from the blizzard album. gary moore has distortion a bit like this

john petrucci/steve vai/joe satriani distortion, this is the one im questioning, its not a natural distortion, its just so much distortion, and they play anything in it, blues, metal, rock...etc but i think its too much and it seems like every good player on youtube has this distortion and it just makes me mad, i dont think it sounds good, i think its been too generalized and that it allows some good players to sound great. i hope you know what i mean ill add some videos to show you

also some of the improvising now all sounds the same unless they are beginners, or really really good. like they make solo albums and have record deals good. but in the middle of that it sounds the same. it seems that people with that type of distortion always have the same "style" and i dont mean to be generalizing or ignorant to those who dont, but im saying a lot of people do, its like just a style i really cant explain it... and it just gets me wondering

why do people like that type of distortion?
do people now develop their own style or just copy other modern players?

ill add some videos to help you understand...

you cant really hear this ones distortion but his style is what i mean:







hopefully you guys see what i mean in todays metal music, i feel its all really the same or close. if you dont agree dont bash me for it, say y u disagree.

That's the way the world's going, they don't understand how simple and ordinary their playing style is. It's so boring now.

i cant listen to new solos anymore bc litterally if its mainstream, the "solo" is ust the vocal melody, or if its new metaal then its that...

Or just a repeated phrase played over and over. Eventually someone decent will rise from these copies.

has to, thats why i think new metal is coming to halt, i stongly dislike the works of satriani, vai, petrucci, etc. a

but the horrid thing isthat we are in an age of musical monkeys. with most mainsteem stuff being disney pop, rap, then you have just below the surface new metal, and emo garbage itll be hard for real music to come back.

That depends on what certain people consider real music though. Mainstream or not real music is always there. But to see the F'n Jonas Brothers get all the mainstream productiion there is, we have Ozzy, who is canceling Ozzfest just to get his new album out. BTW, what do you consider original? I mean I obviously see that those nubs you posted weren't because pasted together they could all be the same song.

ive got nothing against the tone those guys are using, i dont like it that much, but i dont hate it. but yeah they all have the same style, i noticed that when i was looking through the entries awhile ago

its just one contest, ill post covers of songs done with that tone.

ozzy was good, now hes just horrible, his voice is horrible, wylde overuses pinch harmonics, wah, basicly every effect, and his tone is trash.

But from the fast shredder guys they are trying to imitate, the only one i really like is paul gilbert. He does have some really interesting stuff

There are some really spectacular guitarists that solo in Metal EMB. The thing is that you have to keep an open mind when listening to it. I notice you stick to the old days, where everything was just taking off for guitarists, and I was the same way. As a guitarist though I needed something more though. Because music is always changing, sounds are changing, structure of songs are changing, and with that you get people doing alot of the same stuff at times. The 80's hair metal is the perfect example of that, then looked what happened. Everything went in a complete different direction, but that stuff that was so called destroyed in the 90's evolved in the underground scene as metal. New metal really is just an acquired taste. You will grow so much as a musician and a guitarist in opening up to these new sounds. I love the old days man, but the stuff now is good too.

ive listened to both, some old stuff sounds the same but a lot different, no one really had the same tones. but that is true. i just dont like new stuff

Simplicity is good, but the point emb is getting at is that it's TOO simple. From someone with a fair amount of knowledge, these so called musicians only learn the basics and think that's all there is to learn. They show off withered talent.

you guys are thinking to why much about this. the only thing you can control is yourself don't worry about the other people. and good music has never been mainstream is always floating about. And when you say you don't like new music i just find that a case of laziness there always stuff out there. 90s musics didn't just happen people where out playing it for years look at the pixies(who nirvana admitted too ripping off, which isn't saying that's a bad thing just don't like it when people think it came out of now where which even Kurt hatted people thinking) I mean come on look at all the black artist then Pat Boone

the point is do your on thing and you will do fine don't worry about others there going to be mostly dumb in your mind anyway. the pop trends are always behind in the times and are generally lame due to greedy record companies, but things sine through don't worry. and to people who complain about people who like old music...
never look down at the man you see that is taking steps backwards for he may just be getting ready for a big leap.
- i forget who said that

I just cant but agree with RA. What comes to these guys on videos, well they just soloed, Ridvan was a little bit of different of these guys. What I mean to say is that many people think that if guitarist can solo and shred fast its virtuoso and so on. rarely I see hype for the rhythm guitarists...

Ive listened music now for around 25 years intense and I have many times overload of music, I mean what ever I listen, nothing inspires me, everything sound boring... these times just come... and luckily go away too. I see marks of this thing in you Emb, its not a bad thing thou, it is just inevitable.

I agree Emb that metal tones these days do sound bit same, but I think there is a reason to it. These days guitarists just seek techniqal superiority (soloing) and do not pay attention to build or experimenting sound or tones to have an "unique" sound. Like we have many guitarists that do have an unique sound and its distorted in metal as well as blues and even Jazz.

btw, everyone how do not like rap, should check artist named Gil Scott Heron. He told to be one of the most inspirators for the rap music. Well worth to check it out.

just my 2 cents
Empirism

the only rap artist i like is mc hammer. well besides hammer pants. he basicly invented rap kinda. so in a way... u cant tounch this...

I think that the majority of guitar players nowadays do indeed copy or imitate or even 'paraphrase' the playing styles of other more popular guitarists. However, I think that as long as they do a good job of it who cares.
I think that if you are looking for more unique soloing styles listen to more metal. I know you tend to like the 80's metal type stuff, but I'm talking about real, modern day metal. Check out bands like As I Lay Dying or Unearth. There also good old school metal guitarists to check out like, Dimebag Darrell and Michael Ammott.

you have to look hard for good rap because so much of it is flooded with this ego trip gangster rap. try giving a listing to Dr. octagon, Del the funky homosapien/deltron 3030, and of course public enemy, but maybe that goes without saying?

I can see what EMB's getting at with this, I feel the same way a lot of the time. I'm an 80's fan all the way(that's all I really like to listen to) and so of course I love my daily dose of Roth era VH early RR Ozzy and Motley Crue, and of course Tesla. But it seems that with today's music there just isn't the want to have a good rhythm or riff AND solo. For example I've noticed that in most music today, you have high gain, scooped mids, and power chords. While this may not be bad, like the Deftones, its always left me kind of a cold feeling with their tone even though it may sound pretty mean and heavy. But it also seems that a lot of the metal bands that are around today, just want to be the most technical over everyone else.
I recently won an argument over youtube(sadly, I know its stupid) about some guy trying to say basically that just because Michael Angelo Batio was faster than Eddie Van Halen, he was better, even though he like EVH's stuff more. So I replied with speed isn't everything and he got upset and...whatever. What I'm trying to say is that most average people that are not extremely gifted in music or guitar/bass, etc., are saying that 'hey, that guy plays really fast, he's amazing.' While that may be true and be held for the likes of Malmsteen or someone else(Herman Li) I personally would have to say that Malmsteen actually uses speed when its necessary , not really all the time just because it's cool to play a passage fast.
now don't get me wrong, I like to play fast, its pretty fun. I just don't that every fill, solo, whatever should be played as fast as you can do it.
I've recently been experimenting with the major, minor, mixolydian, and dorian modes and have found a unique sound to my playing. It doesn't sound like VH or Randy Rhoads, but it doesn't sound like Malmsteen either. what I'm trying to say is that I believe a lot of guitarists today are trying to copy their idol way too much. Someone would say, "I want to play Vai". So they do that, but not just a touch here or there with his technique, the whole song sounds basically like Vai. While 'Yankee Rose' is an awesome song, I don't think that we need clones of every great guitarist running around.
That's why I think so many tones and techniques today are so similar, everyone is looking back at the groundbreaking styles and sounds of Vai, Satch, Malmsteen, RR, EVH, etc., and just totally copping that style. While my two biggest influences include Randy Rhoads and Eddie Van Halen, I don't want to sound just like them when I play something, if that makes sense. I don't want to have my guitar STYLE match them prefectly, the sound I try to get close to because i am a tone addict, but that's for a different post;) Anyways, I think that most of today's guitarists are taking the music they listened to, the guitarist they looked up to, and are just copying that. So your only going to get so many different types of styles if they look back at the 80's for their inspirations.
Which brings me to DragonForce...I'm not a fan of their music at all. They extend solos to 2-3 minutes and try to play as fast as they can, which to me doesn't take much emotion. i've listened to them enough to know that, as my friend puts it, "they make Spinal Tap look like a real band". Which I actually agree, DF says that they are a cross between Slayer and Journey...i don't know why they would try to do that but they did and they just have Herman Li play something really fast for 2 minutes and try to do something with it.
I believe there's two types of players; those with emotion in their music, and those without. While both can have musical smarts like no other, I will prefer the side that plays with emotion during the song rather than just a drone up there doing what he's programmed to do. That may seem harsh, but when I watch clips of Eric Clapton, BB King, RR, and even EVH, they seem to enjoy playing and want to express themselves through the guitar, not just have it sound cool, but create a mood and try to say something with their playing. Maybe a solo is hectic and just plain crazy for a song about someone going insane, that would fit pretty well. now if a song is a little bit more bluesy the guitarist may just want to get the audience to feel what he/she feels. When a guitarist can play with emotion I will listen to that more easily than some really cool fast stuff. It seems to me that even though I don't like most metal today, the bands whose guitarists play with emotion in the studio and on-stage, have a different feel to their music than someone who just plays.
To be fair, I think that every guitarist hits a wall at some point and just can't seem to find a unique sound or trademark lick or something until one day, it just happens. Then they can start toward that direction or maybe continue the way that they played before.i believe that's why so many guitarist sound so alike today, most have a lot of the same inspirations and most of them get stuck a certain point with their own unique sound.

And RA is right about that, I prefer the Beastie Boys and Run-DMC over anything today. You just gotta look hard, and you never know you might get a killer riff idea from Tupac.

Well, I'd say that was about a dollar's worth of cents to get in:)

Case

The only rap I like is the really offensive kind. It's hilarious. Especially Eminem. Sorry for going mainstream on everyone lol.

lol ozz fan.

case hit it hard on the head, couldnt really have said it better, and i know of run dmc, i saw them with skynyrd.

two words that = slow-melodic-angular-fast-wtf?-Bluesy-country/Jazz-jazz !?
= Bill Frisell

and i very much second that Paul Gilbert! PG is definitely an original.

and a big nod to the great unsung Dave Gregory (XTC)

HAHA. Excellent :D

@ Case,
whew, I gotta take a nap now after reading that! Very well said.
Phip

Are you taking part in the competition EMB?

ehh not really. i just like playing.

I don't mind that over-the-top distortion when it's turned on for just the solo. Some legato techniques just don't sound that cool when they're played without distortion. It does get a little obnoxious when it's on throughout the whole song, I'll give you that. Also, the Zeppelin distortion is what I always try to get. You don't feel like an idiot playing a solo with it, and you could strum through some chords if you needed to.

@Phip
Haha, that actually did take me some time to write too!
Enjoy that nap:)

haha Case! you could write a book on it I bet!

Exactly. Everyone's so stuck with this idea that speed is everything. A good slap in the face is well deserved! Unfortunately, they have fans there.

But... when I really think about it though, these people like speed, but what for? What is their reason? And I thought, maybe that's their way of expressing their passion. You never really know. As pointless as it is to me, they obviously enjoy what they're doing, so really they deserve as much of a chance at fame as we do.

EVEN though I think the faster you get, the more it starts to sound like fuzz and melodies are less appreciated... these people obviously don't know any better. Or they're bored, or tired of the same stuff just like us. Maybe they're attempting to create something new and lost themselves in fame. The fact is, they're out there, and people like them just as much as they like their own stuff so we can't really pick them apart and mock them, because we're not out there... EVEN though (in my honest opinion) we deserve it more than them, it's not our choice to make.

So we all just have to work harder, and really, when we do make it out there, won't it be that much more rewarding? Our effort will be appreciated, because people like us will actually be able to listen to stuff they enjoy.

Just enjoy yourselves as much as you can, and don't pay attention to any of the others.

this is why i think the last great guitarist is randy rhoads. he i believe he was at the beginning and end of 2 eras for guitarists, and basicly combined the 2 along with classical. but i cant stand speed. i played a gig with punk bands and scream bands and meatalcore bands. horrid. my ears wanted to commit suicide lol. its was just musical rape. punk now is just trash, they payed covers of some horrible songs from some horrible bands, then came the screamo which i did leave from and went to practice outside by the curb. then went back inside when i heard them done and thought i was going on, then came metalcore, basicly screaming+fast *. it was even worse, the scream vocals + fast sloppy, rhythmless, melodyless noisy playing just raped my ears.

Okay there, I disagree. Sorry but to say that Randy was the last great guitarist is just, for lack of a better word, dumb. You have EVH, Dimebag, Slash, Zakk Wylde [Until he went harmonic crazy, but the acoustic stuff is great]. Yngwie, Paul Gilbert, James Hetfield, SRV, Jeff Beck, Vai, and Satch, McLaughlin, Al Di Meola, Pace De Lucia, Izzy Stradlin [former rhythm for Gn'R, great player, way underrated], and many others.

i think emb covered that he hates most of those guitarists, which really isnt fair because like vai or petrucci, its not their fault everyone copies their style and sound

many tried to copy SRV, none hit the spot.

no i never said i hate them i ment that i never really liked them. sure there are still great guitarists, i guess i went far there. i guess what i ment to say is mainstreem guitarists after the 70s /80s era just declined rapidly with few good ones.

jeff beck is from the 60s/70s.

i cant stand how people like instrumental "rock" and consider it good. its just horrible. if im going to listen to instrumentals i wana listen to bach, mozart, chopain, shubert...

Really, you could look at that "new guitar heroes" Rolling Stone. John Frusciante, John Mayer, and Derek Trucks are all very good guitarists. There are many more too: Johnny Greenwood, Mikael Åkerfeldt, Justin Hawkins, etc.

EMB, most people [like myself] don't really listen to instrumental rock for enjoyment. They listen to it for the skill of the player, and to possibly try to gain some inspiration. Yes Beck is from then, but he was still making good music after "The Last Great Guitarist" died. Also, I'm totally agreeing with BBT that it's not the virtuoso's like Vai, Petrucci, Satch, Gilbert, etc. get copied. They sure as hell don't encourage it. some people want and know how to be original. Some just want to sound like those guys. And from what I'm seeing with those vids, there are a lot of copy-cats. But thats their own fault. Trying to explain to you that Rhoads wasn't the only "Great" player is pointless because from what I've observed you're just THAT narrow-minded musically. In other word it's a lost-cause of an argument.

I'm done,
Ozz

So, as y'all know i'm a pretty big fan of the jam bands and such. I was watching this DVD of phish, where the guitar player (Trey) and bass player (Mike) were walking around and talking in a gun shop talking about the night before's show.

The Mike notes that The Trey played a lot of notes.

The reason I bring that up is sometimes i think guitar players over play. Do they really need to play that many notes? Now wouldn't 7 well placed notes say more or at least the same as 68 fast played notes?

I know a lot of y'all are into metal and fast playing comes with that.

of the guitar player's I've seen listed, there are not alot that I would feel are truly great players, maybe skillfully fast, but not great. I'm sure I get a lot of crap for saying that too. I want to hear someone's soul come through in the music, and I don't see or hear that very often. Someone who gives me goose bumps when the play, i find that truly virtuosic.

I know what you mean man. Of the ones I personally listed were just some that I know a lot of people are really into. Personally I'd rather have like a couple notes that can make someone cry or feel happy rather than 150 that can make someone go "What the f**k was that?". I think my style that I'm finally comfortably with is that Aerosmith, Gn'R, Alice Cooper mixed with some heavier stuff once in a while like Megadeth or something.

did u even read my last post?

derek trucks is fantasic. i saw him live.

Who are you talking to?